Dobermanns in Germany in 1960's and 70's and their breeding utilisation

Below is a translated transcript from pages 22–63 from the book 'Zucht und Sport mit dem Dobermann' by Dobermann Judge and breeder Ottmar Vogel. In this section of the book Ottmar Vogel writes about prominent Dobermanns from the beginning of the 60's to the early 80's.

Chico v. Forell
Odin v. Forell
Falko v. Hagenstolz

	Chico v. Forell
	Odin v. Forell
	Falko v. Hagenstolz

Chico v. Forell, descends from Odin v. Forell (Champion SchH2), whose father was Falko v. Hagenstolz (BDSG SchH1) and his mother was BDSG Cita Germania (from the very successful kennel "von Germania", Owner: Mr. August Schneider of Remscheid Germany). Chico's clear strengths were his very compact, square build with strong bone, very wide and deep chest, beautifully ascending topline, with a long upper arm as well as correct croup and tail set. The angulation of his hindquarters were regarded as somewhat steep. His pronounced broad head was strong yet long with a small arch however (Roman nose) on the nose bridge line. Chico's excellent build was established via his father Odin Forell and grandfather Falko, because Odin and Falko were also short powerful dogs, substantial and with good bone strength. Odin should have maybe had a somewhat longer head. Odin had a very thick coat of hair, although some of his offspring had even longer hair. In breeding however this wasn't of great importance.

 

Overall the temperament of Falko, Odin as well as Chico's can be described as medium. Falko and Odin demonstrated a certain learning capability through their training titles and, from my recollection, I would describe the nerve-strength as average. Chico was not quite stable-nerved in his youth, which perhaps had to do with Ernst W. trying to train these dogs and not entirely giving Chico in the hands of trainers. The dog was very often torn back and forth between training and compulsion without a real relationship on the one hand, and overcautious treatment at home on the other. It is obvious that this does not contribute to the stability of a young dog. At the first ever organized DV Sieger Show in 1969 in Würzburg, Chico was DV Sieger at the age of 16 months. At the time the Sieger dog still didn't need any training titles for the qualification of Sieger.

Cita Germania

 

Later attempts by Ernst Wilking to have Chico trained failed altogether, so that the firm assumption would be that Chico was not particularly trainable (führig) and willing to work. I myself had once worked with Chico as a young dog during preliminary protection work and I can say that someone must have worked with him already in order to reach a reasonable performance. His mother Cita Germania brown BDSG 1964 also only had a rather normal temperament that in my opinion couldn't withstand strong pressure. I had often observed this bitch in calm situations. Cita was wonderful in her elegance and had a long and yet strong feminine head with just as beautiful long and powerful neck. Mind you that when the bitch became the 1964 BDSG it was probably only because the judge recognised the beauty of this bitch despite her lousy condition. On both days of the show Cita was skinny like a towel and in very bad condition. Today something similar probably would not be possible since essentially it is much more competitive even in the brown class. At that time however this bitch became Bundessiegerin under the judge Walter Maurer (Kennel von Hagenstolz).

Lex v. Forell

	Titus Germania
	Vilja Germania

At this show a black male, namely Lex von Forell (Titus Germania SchH1, BDSG - Vilja Germania) became Bundessieger defeating well-known competition like Kandy v. Fürstenfeld (SchH1), Jago v. Fürstenfeld (SchH2), Blitz v. Roggenfelde (SchH3).

It was unfortunate for the whole Doberman breed that this dog was sold abroad and was not or almost not used for breeding in Germany. I believe that the breeders at the time didn't recognise the value of this dog otherwise they would have kept this dog in Germany.

Now getting back to Chico v. Forell. Today one can confidently say that he decisively shaped the present day appearance of our Dobermanns. Chico mainly transmitted his excellent build and was very well suited as a partner to balance or compensate for bitches that exhibited a lack of substance and over-refinement / delicate.

Chico v. Forell

Of course there is and was no improvement expected from Chico with respect to fighting instinct and hardness because from where should this improvement come? Chico merely transmitted on average a good solidity of nerves, which was really lacking at this time and I would therefore like to say with all clearness that for me, this dog contributed his part to our current improvement of temperament. Furthermore the dog was free of disease (intestinal sensitivity, nervous Mangen - and intestinal sensitivity associated with inflammation of the pancreas (Maldigest Malasoptions syndrome), thin coat, etc., that we could indeed observe with several Dobermanns. Chico lived to be 10 years of age.

	Ero v. Frankenhorst
	Amarilda Wachenburg
	Andy v. Eichenhain

Jago v. Beelen
Olive of Bamby's Pride
Rita Forell

His best son might have been Jago v. Beelen (brown, SchH2 gekört for life, BDSG, Int-Ch, DV-Sg). I'll come to this dog later. Also Ero v. Frankenhorst (black, SchH3, VH3, angekört for 2 years, DV-Sg, BDSG, IDC-Sg, Holland Winner, etc.) was an outstanding son of Chico. In 1979 as a participant of the DV-Siegerprüfung in Aachen with 289 points he was graded excellent and placed 4th and it was the first time, a show champion genuinely competed extremely well in a major competition. However his transmitting power is not as highly valued as Jago v. Beelen. The mother of Ero Frankenhorst is the black Amarilda v.d. Wachenburg, a German import to Holland. She descends from inbreeding on Andy v. Eichenhain (SchH1, BDSG 1965). Another brood bitch of the kennel v. Frankenhorst was the black Olive of Bamby's Pride, a Japanese export to Holland however from German ancestors, i.e. Odin Forell and Rita Forell (SchH1, BDSG) an Arco of Fayette Corner daughter over Citto v. Fürstenfeld, see bloodline plan. This bitch has produced several outstanding breeding dogs with various stud dogs with national and international titles that presently continue to influence the Doberman breeding in the Netherlands.

But now back to the beginning of the '60s.

One of the leading kennels besides “von Forell" at that time was the kennel “von Fürstenfeld" (Owner: Mr. Palmer from Fürstenfeldbruck). Many very beautiful dogs came out this kennel, particular for the time, and often were noted for their elegance, dark markings and wonderful head type. Furthermore, the breeder knew his dogs would bring in the correct conformation. Also the breeder managed to strengthen his desired type by selected inbreeding.

Carmen v. Felsingpass
Lump v. Hagenstolz

	Citto v. Fürstenfeld
	Citta v. Fürstenfeld

The combination between Carmen v. Felsingpass (black, SchH1, BDSG) and 1956 Welt-Sieger Lump v. Hagenstolz (black, SchH1) produced some very beautiful Siegers, e.g. Citto and Citta v. Fürstenfeld (IDC-Sg, BDSG, Int-Ch), that strongly influenced the breed later.

From the von Fürstenfeld “B litter” the male “Bordo v. Fürstenfeld” strongly influenced this bloodline with regard to the character and improvement of combative instinct. I tested this male and he had an above average combative instinct.

The combination between Bordo v. Fürstenfeld and Citta v. Fürstenfeld was repeated about 5 times to my knowledge (K, L, M, U, V) and they have produced some great dogs like Kandy v. Fürstenfeld (black, SchH1, V rated male) who is known as a stable strong male, Owner: Kennel v. Frankenland, Mr. Schellmann of Marktbreit. The L-Litter was sold abroad and therefore is not well-known.

Mascha v. Fürstenfeld
Mecki v. Fürstenfeld
Vello v. Fürstenfeld

	Miko v. Fürstenfeld

The "M-Litter" produced the known brother and sister Mascha v. Fürstenfeld (black, SchH3, BDSG, Int-Ch, DDR-Sg, Owner: Kennel von Bavaria, Haus Wiblishauser of Munich) Mecki von Fürstenfeld (brown, SchH3, BDSG, Int-Ch, Owner: Ms Theis of Hamburg). Both dogs were extremely successful in their show careers and at the same time also managed to be successful in working trials. Further more there was also the V rated male Miko v. Fürstenfeld (SchH1, Int-Ch).

From the "U-litter" the only known dog is "Uta", however in conformation she was not of noteworthiness. Other dogs from this litter were not shown. To my knowledge several had dentition faults.

The Litter most famous to this day is the "V Litter". This litter produced Vilja v. Fürstenfeld (black SchH1, BDSG in 1967, owner: J. Adler Hamburg), Vello v. Fürstenfeld (black, SchH3, gekört for life, in my possession), as well as “Verry v. Fürstenfeld” (SchH3, DV Leistungssieger in 1970, owner: J. Flögel Recklinghausen). Whilst Vilja and Verry did not bring anything to the breed (Verry was of poor constitution), and it has been reported as not being a successful litter, however it can be said today that Vello v. Fürstenfeld became an excellent sire for and admittedly, something very rare until now, the extent of transmitting his conformation as well as his working abilities.

Unfortunately, Vello and Verry were very feminine males lacking in substance, bone strength and masculine features. Therefore, only those matings which could compensate for these deficiencies were successful.

Ina v. Fürstenfeld

Other well-known dogs were Ina v. Fürstenfeld (black, BDSG, from Citto v. Fürstenfeld and Tonka Germania), and then out of the father-daughter (Citto v. Fürstenfeld-Ina) mating “O-Litter" Orli, Odin, Ondra, with Orli becoming Welt-jugdsg, however shortly afterwards he fell victim to an accident. This male was very large with a strong head, however somewhat long in the back, his brother, Odin was written as unfit for breeding due to dentition faults. His sister “Ondra v. Fürstenfeld” (SchH2, black) was in my mind a very nice dog, she received V1, however was then beaten for the BDSG title by the Kandy v. Fürstenfeld daughter Goldi Felsingpass. I personally trained Ondra who was a raw inexperienced dog to SchH1 within four weeks. This bitch had an outstanding character and was highly trainable with strong fighting instinct and nerve-strength. This female also had a good amount of hardness. Unfortunately this dog was sold to the USA, and so we lost a good breeding dog when you consider that she originated from close inbreeding.

Jago v. Fürstenfeld
Hella v. Forell

Another very well-known and successful male was Jago v. Fürstenfeld (black SchH2, from Bordo v. Fürstenfeld and Carmen v. Felsingpass, Owner: kennel v. Eichenhain Jakob Bambach, Dreieichenhain). The male, who never became BDSG, was always among the best V rated males of the time, had the problem of a weak underjaw, which he inherited from his mother Carmen v. Felsingpass. Unfortunately he also often produced this fault. His son Andy v. Eichenhain (SchH1, BDSG in 1965, from Jago v. Fürstenfeld SchH2 – Hella v. Forell) had an even worse type of head, feminine and weak jaw. In my opinion it was a mistake to make this male the Bundessieger, because after that he was very often used for breeding and even today it’s possible to still see the influence of this head type. Hence, we want to show how long it often takes in breeding to improve on these certain errors. Jago however had an outstanding structure which he obviously reproduced very well. It can be said that he produced some outstanding offspring, where he did not have an adverse effect on the head type, that were very harmonious in their structure.

In character Jago v. Fürstenfeld and Andy v. Eichenhain can be described as medium, that is, both dogs were trainable up to a certain degree, however they were never challenged on the working test. Nerve were normal and they both were not flighty. The mother of Andy v. Eichenhain, was very good in her nerve-constitution and self-assurance and has definitely contributed in improving the overall temperament.

	Arco of Fayette Corner
	Welda v. Fürstenfeld

Rondo v. Forell
Rado v. Fürstenfeld

It should be noted out of the female Cita Germania and the Citto v. Fürstenfeld son Arco of Fayette Corner (SchH3, DC-Sg) came the BDSG Rondo v. Forell (SchH1), however he was soon sold to Japan and did not influence the breeding much.

Similarly, BDSG Rado v. Fürstenfeld was only used a few times for breeding in Holland, as this male also went to Japan.

Now in the kennel Fürstenfeld, from the W-dogs (Welda, Windo etc.) onwards, the existing breeding base had narrowed over time that the tight inbreeding, and the once valuable breeding traits, no longer offset the faults and therefore had lost their value.

	Argus v. Neroberg

The female Gina v. Fürstenfeld (black, SchH 3) should be noted, as her breeding to an average male Lump v. Basterhof (black), produced the Bundessieger Argus v. Neroberg (brown, SchH 3), of the Kennel von Rauhfelsen, Breeder: Willi Rothfuss, Stuttgart. This dog was very powerful and compact with a very well-balanced character. Argus was often bred and today we still find his traits in the Ellendonk line in the Nordrhein region and partly in the Württemberg breeding region. He brought stability to the line with respect to substance and nerve.

The von Ellendonk Kennel, Owner E. and F. Sauermann of Krefeld, were spoken about at the time. The Sauermann married couple, were essentially training specialists who had previously achieved considerable success with German Shepherds.

Dixi v. Krakau

	Gerra v. Ellendonk
	Jessy v. Ellendonk

Their first female, Dixi v. Krakau (brown, out of Dirk v. Goldberg SchH 3 BDSG – Elke v. Saint Clemens) became D.V. Leistungssieger in 1964 in Bonn. I had seen the trial and despite her mistakes at that time, she left an outstanding impression and deserved the Sieger title. Anatomically this medium-size female earned "excellent" with slight faults. She is the foundation female of the von Ellendonk Kennel and asserted her traits through various males with respect to temperament. Out of the breeding with the Leistungsrüde Astor v.d. Schimmel Schulz Heide SchH 3 (multiple participant in D.V. Leistungsprüfungen) and Dixi came the Leistungssieger of 1966 Gerra v. Ellendonk  and the Leistungsrüde Gero v. Ellendonk  (brown, SchH 3). Both dogs strengthened (or consolidated) the working reputation of this line and they also consistently rated "excellent" at shows. Gerra was then bred with BDSG Argus v. Neroberg (brown, SchH 3). Out of the important "J-Litter" came some beautiful and good working dogs; such as: Jenny v. Ellendonk (brown, SchH 3), often V1 rated in conformation and the foundation female of the Kennel v.d. Räuberhöhle, Owner: Gero Müller of Göppingen.

Iris v. Ellendonk

	Miko v. Fürstenfeld
	Vesta v. Ellendonk

Out of the "I-Litter" the BDSG Iris v. Ellendonk (brown, SchH 1) should be mentioned, as her breeding with Miko v. Fürstenfeld (black, SchH 1) produced the D.V. Leistungssieger of 1975, Palma v. Ellendonk  (Black, SchH 3, Angekört for Life). The D.V. Leistungssieger of 1971 Immo v. Ellendonk (Brown, SchH 3), was not used for breeding.

Many good working dogs came out of the von Ellendonk Kennel, with the Nordrhein region improving the poor/battered working reputation of the breed. The Sauermann's also produced some Siegers in beauty, such as BDSG Kora v. Ellendonk, SchH 1 (Argus v. Neroberg – Gerra v. Ellendonk); BDSG Iris v. Ellendonk; the blue DVSG Vesta v. Ellendonk SchH 1 (Chico v. Forell and Jessy v. Ellendonk); the DV Jugendsieger Ulfas v. Ellendonk brown SchH 1, Angekört (Gero v. Elendonk and Afra v. Honenstauf); the World Youth Sieger, Xyla v. Ellendonk SchH 1, Angekört.

Other noteworthy working dogs were also Satan and Sanko v. Ellendonk, both Angekört, and also the daughter of Sanko and Palma v. Ellendonk - Afra v. Ellendonk (Black, SchH 3, FH, Angekört for Life, V rated in conformation, owner Kennel v. Burg Böheim-Stein, H. Schauer of Pegnitz), and Trux v. Ellendonk, multiple participant at the D.V. Siegerprüfungen.

Bingo v. Ellendonk

The best working dog was and, however is, the D.V. Leistungssieger Bingo v. Ellendonk (Sire: Jago v. Beelen, SchH 2, brown, Angekört for Life, BDSG, DVSG, Int.Ch. – Dam: Palma v. Ellendonk, Angekört for Life, D.V. Leistungssieger). This male at two years of age had already become D.V. Leistungssieger in 1977, and has since then, an unbroken succession where he has rarely been beaten out of anything less than second place. This male was titled over 30 times in SchH 3 and always captivated/impressed through his consistent work. He was taken to several European FCI Championships and constantly impressed with his enormous fighting instinct and his steady and strong nerves.

This dog has been very interestingly bred and it may be said that the temperament traits have been inherited from both sides, as can be seen from the line of ancestors and the bloodline chart. It is very encouraging that he has already left a strong working mark on his offspring and so it is hoped that the male continues to be intelligently and sensibly used for breeding. As is often naturally the case, this dog also has faults that come to light with certain matings.

	Bingo v. Ellendonk

According to his reasonable conformation this dog is to be assessed as a high-SG-dog, he also already has an excellent rating (3rd place). In terms of his use, one should pay attention to his somewhat poor state in the forehand and his back, which is long and not quite firm. With his height of 68 cm, Bingo fits exactly into the medium-size range. It is of course, always difficult to maintain height. Presently, we are unfortunately swaying a little too much and we must try to stabilise the correct height for dogs at approximately 68–70 cm. Oversize as well as undersize will not meet our goal for building our working dog lines.

Ilo v. Kirchbühl

	Cora v. Papenkamp

Bingo's first offspring were successes at the DV Siegerprüfungen in 1980 and 1981. In 1980, the two year old "Hexe vom Wilden Markgraf", black, SchH 3, RHT, ADPr, (Bingo v. Ellendonk, SchH 3, IPO 3, Angekört for Life, FH – Bina v. Wilden Markgraf, SchH 3, IPO 3, FH, Angekört for Life) earned twelfth place with 275 points (SG rating) and in 1981 Ilo v. Kirchbühl, black, SchH 3, Angekört (Bingo Ellendonk – Cora v. Kirchbuhl) earned 276 points in the D.V. Siegerprufung, and also in 1981 Cora v. Papenkamp SchH 3 (Bingo v. Ellendonk – Afra v. Papenkamp) became the D.V. Leistungssiegerin.

Also interesting is the fact that both Hexe and Cora are similarly bred, in that they both have the Leistungsrüden Falk v. Rotbachtal as a grandfather on their mother's side. Falk's Grandfather in turn, was the three-time Leistungssieger of 1961-1963 Fred v.d. Blütenstadt Orsoi. Here you can see with respect to their structure how such a line is built up.

And now back to the Ellendonk Kennel. Some years ago, after the wife of the breeder passed away, Mr. Sauermann also ended his active work with the Dobermann. Nevertheless, there are several breeding animals with valuable genetics from this kennel, so hope remains to consolidate and improve on this foundation.

Vello v. Fürstenfeld

But now back to Vello v. Fürstenfeld 1966-75, DZB 79814 black SchH3, HD1, gekört for life (Bordo v. Fürstenfeld - Citta v. Fürstenfeld BDSG int. Ch. IDC Sg.). I received this male at 7 weeks of age in exchange for the training Ondra v. Fürstenfeld. With this male, who was somewhat a feminine type, I had completed SchH3 and the first Kreisausscheidung by 2 years of age, where the male already quite impressively worked in Schutzdienst (protection work). I would like to represent objectively and speak of errors, so that the breeders and beginners of today understand I have warned against a strong dependence on this male. Vello was very hard and uncompromising in the fighting instinct, though at times somewhat nervous and noise sensitive. This had nothing to do with gun shyness, because he was fine here. However often with little things, especially in very light or very dark situations I often noted a restlessness/unrest to noise with Vello. Furthermore, he was also sensitive to thunderstorms. Then I found out in different tests that the preparedness for combat (Kampfbereitschaft) in Vello dominated over the noise sensitivity. He was normal in other dealings with strange people, although he defended his area. However, if I let the dog free around people, he was without inhibitions and completely at ease and open. I passed SchH3 about forty times with Vello, and only twice he didn't get the required points in tracking. 4th place in the 1970 DV Siegerprüfung, 6th Place in the 1972 Siegerprüfung with a different handler. On this occasion, I wanted to test to what extent his behaviour was depended on me during the work. I had tried the same thing then in various cup matches (about 20) where Vello was deployed in protection. On each occasion there is no doubt I was fully convinced about Vello’s fighting instinct and hardness. However, Vello also showed a little bit of subordination, which often was reflected in tracking and obedience. In Conformation Vello was always graded excellent (V), even though in his overall picture he was somewhat feminine with a long-looking back, which was however firm. Vello received V1 Cacib, Cac Res. etc. several times, although, he has no sieger title. Though as Vello has sufficiently demonstrated, this is not in fact necessarily a prerequisite for inheritance.

	Bonni v. Forell

Bryan v. Forell

The first breeder who recognised the value of this male was Ernst Wilking "Kennel von Forell". The B-litter from Vello and Kira v. Romberg  produced the famous male Bryan v. Forell black Nord. Cham. and  Bonni v. Forell  SchH1 Brown BDSG, DVSG, int. Champ. Both males have strongly influenced breeding especially over here with Bryan descendants now living in Germany and Holland. Then out of the same combination the only female worth noting is  Dasha v. Forell, since she is the mother of  Jago v. Beelen. A breeding attempt between Vello and Cita Germania failed due to the advanced age of the female.

Bronco v. Zenn

Another very good combination came about between Vello and Biene v.d. Stollburg brown female from the kennel vom Pfälzer Waldheim. The combination was repeated several times with a number of very good Dobermanns being produced. The B-litter produced DTS-Champ. and VDH-Sg Bulli v. Pfälzer Waldheim, brown SchH3 Angekört for life and the female Bianca v. Pfälzer Waldheim,  black SchH3 Angekört, unfortunately passed away early due to an accident. The C-litter produced the well-known DV Leisterssieger  Citta v. Pfälzer Waldheim,  black SchH3, FH, Angekört for life: owner Kennel  v. d. Stollburg, B. Maul of Dingolshausen; and from the E-litter the female  Elke v. Pfälzer Waldheim,  schwarz DTSch Champ SchH3 Angekört for life VDH-SG, owner Kennel  v. Zenn, F. and M. Lindemann, dam of Weltsg Bronco v. Zenn, who I will discuss later.

	Gogo v.d. Veste Otzberg

Gisella v.d. Veste Otzberg

A mating between Vello Fürstenfeld and Frigga v.d. Veste Otzberg produced a very successful combination for the breeder J. Bäcker of Lengfeld “v.d. Veste Otzberg”, who sold the litter to the Nordic countries. This combination produced Siegerinnen Gisella und Gogo v.d. Veste Otzberg, who were outstanding in the type and decisively improved the local Dobermann breed.

Also the top V male Ino v. Eichenhain (Vello - Hella v. Forell) should be mentioned here as he was sold to Sweden in his youth.

I would like to mention Weltjugendsg Sascha v. Niddatal, black, Breeder W. Hensel and V male Rondo v. Niddatal from the large number of direct descendants of Vello that received V at conformation shows and also showed very good performances in working trials. These dogs did not influence the breed because Rondo lived in Spain and the owners were not interested in breeding, and Sascha passed away at 1.5 years of age from a broken neck. The actual loss was only recognised after Vello's offspring inherited his positive traits. So today we nearly have Vello in all the top lines.Today it would extremely difficult to find a breeding without Bonni v. Forell and Bryan v. Forell, and his son Guy's Hilo v. Norden Stamm SchH3 BDSG.

Pero v. Frankenland

Some breeders inherited Vello's bloodline by developing their breeding foundation around Bonni v. Forell, Sieger Ero v. Hagenstern, Sieger Gido v. Hagenstern, Sieger Jürgen v. Hagenstern, all out of (Bonni - Dona v. Eichenhain) as well as the 2 time DV Leistungssieger Pero v. Frankenland 1978 and 1979 (Bonni - Fesa Frankenland) and today mainly through Vello's grandson Bronco v. Zenn SchH3 angekört. We should also take note that Vello's son Bryan Forell lived for over 11 years of age.

Hardes Nömmegarten

	Kora v. Ellendonk

With the help of the bloodline chart we can objectively recognise to an extent, which top descendants also asserted themselves in the breed. Some Sieger dogs such as Hardes Nömmegarten, Bero Möllhoven, Kora Ellendonk were either used too little for breeding or their offspring didn't develop above average and assert themselves.

Bonni v. Forell

Bonni Forell's career could be traced here in Germany and he got all the titles that could be achieved at the time. At exhibitions, he showed himself as a relatively calm representative of the breed with a very nice short powerful build, very nice brown color and dark markings. If something was to be criticised, then his head could have been somewhat stronger and more elongated. He was trained in SchH1. He did not pass the 1970 Körung due to lack of fight drive, though in my opinion he was was not prepared well enough.

Bryan v. Forell
Guy's Hilo v. Nord. Stamm
Ali v. Langenhorst

	Caecilius Cassander
	Orpheus v. Eschenhof
	Amboss v. Langenhorst

Bonni's brother Bryan was sold to Sweden before 5 months of age, shortly before departure I had the opportunity to see Bryan with Ernst Wilking. Even as a young dog you could recognise his expected beauty and nerve strength. In the Nordic countries, Bryan won everything and also passed the local Körung, which certainly is not easy. His offspring have been exceptionally good and today he set the standards in these countries. One of his best known sons Guys Hilo Norden Stamm came to Germany with his owner to continue his bloodline here. Also in the Netherlands, some breeders bred several times with Bryan and obtained very good results. The best offspring were bred with the Vello daughter Gisella v.d. Otzberg Champ. Today offspring which are currently used for breeding through his son Guy's Hilo Norden Stamm are Caecilius Cassander v. Diaspora SchH1, Orpheus v. Eschenhof SchH3, or Amboss v. Langenhorst, SchH3 and Ali v. Langenhorst, SchH3, IDCSG 1982, BDSG 1982, DVSG 1983.

Ali v. Langenhorst, this big black male (71 cm) is from German breeding. At the Worldwinner Show in Dortmund, judge Wiblishauser wrote about him: a 3 1/2 year old male with a good build and substance. He has the right size. The topline and tailset are correct. He stands right on his feet, good angulation, good chest with paralel planes and strong bones. The markings are dark enough, eyes are middle brown, the chest markings are not so clear. In the front movement the legs are "turning out". In character he is outstanding. He is a courageous, hard dog with very high fighting and protecting spirit. He passed Schutzhund III several times with 100 points for his manwork. At the "Körung" he got 1A for life. In 1982 he became Bundessieger, in 1984      Europasieger and DV Sieger in 1983. He has his German Champion title as well his International title.

Dona v. Eichenhain
Jürgen v. Hagenstern

	Ero v. Hagenstern
	Greif v. Hagenstern

Bonni v. Forell offspring from the combination with Dona Eichenhain (a Rondo Forell daughter) are amongst his most successful in terms of beauty. Many winners emerged from this combination and today they influence some breeding in Holland, England and France. Bundessieger and DVSg Ero v. Hagenstern was sold to France, Greif v. Hagenstern DVSG to England and Jürgen v. Hagenstern to Holland. Jürgen produced very good offspring with some Siegers coming from the Forellheim kennel. What these dogs are generally missing is hardness. Their nerve constitution is often described as normal. Positively, the “Forellheim” brood bitch Amanda v. Stifthub has Ellendonk line by the way of Hesta v. Ellendonk via Dixi v. Krakau. Thereby, a certain strength of character is achieved.

Ali v. Forellenbächle
Prinz v. Forellenbächle
Flint v. Forell

	Amanda v. Stifthub
	Dixi Veste Otzberg
	Eick v. Esehenhof

Parallel to Vello's breeding utilisation was the male BDSG-DVS Ali v. Forellenbächle, an Argus Neroberg son, very strong in breeding. Ali was a really very beautiful Sieger, who was powerful and yet equipped with the necessary elegance. Maternally he came about Astrid v. Eichenhain on Jago v. Fürstenfeld. Unfortunately, he didn’t have a very pronounced temperament and didn’t produce any direct offspring worth mentioning. In conformation you can find several Siegers produced under this line through his son Prinz v. Forellenbächle, DVSg SchH2, as well as daughters Dixi v.d. Veste Otzberg, DVSg SchH1 and Frigga v.d. Veste Otzberg, SchH1.

Another male who only briefly influenced the breeding was Flint v. Forell, BDSG DVSg (Chico-Kira). His most interesting offspring may be the V male Eick v. Esehenhof, SchH1. He is characterised today as the ancestor of Nymphenburg dogs like Athene, Athos, Atlas, Argus, Brutus, Berenike, Bellona, Baucis etc. Together with the Jago Hagenstern daughter Helena v. Esehenhof, VHD, SchH2 gekört for life, dogs standing today for breeding utilisation have emerged from the B-litter.

Athene		Argus		Brutus		Berenike		Bellona

 

Boris Herkules
Falk v. Rotbachtal
Flax v. Kirchbühl

	Dolli Andreasstift
	Jaro v.d. Stollburg

I would also like to draw back on the V male Boris v. Herkules, SchH1 of BDSG Dolli Andreasstift SchH2. This male was also heavily used for breeding in parallel to Vello. Based on the variety of his offspring, the inheritance strength cannot be called excellent. Many offspring clearly received excellent, however they could not further produce.

I would like to mention the V-male Falk v. Rotbachtal, SchH3 gekört for life due to his strength of character and producing qualities. This male goes beyond the triple Leistungssieger Fred v. Blütenstadt Orsoy, SchH3 to Alf v. Hagenfreund, sire of WSG Lump Hagenstolz. Falk can be confidently described as the hardest Dobermann of his time. Because our breed still suffers from a lack of hardness, the use of this male was completely justified. It’s proven Falk has produced the most Kör dogs, as well as the two Leistungssiegers Jaro v.d. Stollburg, gekört for life SchH3 - conformation V and Flax v. Kirchbühl, SchH3 - conformation SG. Furthermore, he is the sire of some important breeding females such as Bina v. W. Markgraf - SchH3 FH gekört for life, Afra Papenkamp SchH3 gekört for life (dam of DV LSG 81 Cora), Jacky Frankenland, Esta Kirchbühl SchH3 FH angekört, Cora Kirchbühl etc. I am convinced that this bloodline revitalised and genuinely improved the character. Naturally, improvement in conformation cannot be expected from this male, even though he has produced some V-dogs.

Jago v. Beelen
Bronco v. Zenn
Alexa v. Heiderhof
Eicke v. Stadtwald

The still living BDSG DVSG Jago v. Beelen, SchH2 gekört for life is also strongly represented in the breed. His best son is the WSG DVSG BDSG IDC etc. Bronco Zenn, SchH3 angekört, who presently is being heavily used for breeding. Jago Beelen is distinguished by his outstanding structure and proportions, however he has minor head defects (nasal bone line) just like his sire Chico. He is heavyset male and yet also noble. His dam is the Vello daughter Dascha Forell (full sister to Bonni, Bryan). Through Jago improvement in the overall structure can be achieved and some breeders have already proven this. I consider his temperament as normal, with good nerve strength. His hardness and his fighting spirit is good as well, but technical mistakes were certainly made in training.

	Gwendy v. Frankenland
	Castra v. Frankenland

His son Bronco Zenn has inherited the very strong bone strength and firmness, but with a better head and the improvement probably coming from the Vello line. His hardness is good, but he should have more fighting spirit as a whole. This male is characterised by his high nerve-strength and self-assuredness. Bronco's dam is the V female Elke Pfälzer Waldheim SchH3 gekört for life, who is a Vello daughter. So it can be seen from this example how Bronco was methodically bred. He has already produced an IDC Siegerin who was bred in Holland. Also the BDSG 82 and WSG 83 Gwendy v. Frankenland SchH2, FH, Brown (Bronco Zenn SchH3 - Castra v. Frankenland (daughter of Athos v. Nymphenburg, SchH3, angekört and Xira Norden Stamm SchH1, gekört for life), as well as the BDSG 82 Alexa v. Heiderhof, SchH3 black (Bronco Zenn SchH3 - Eicke v. Stadtwald SchH3 (out of Nero Hagenstern and Alexa Taubergrund = Boris Herkules SchH1 and Mira Frankenland to Kandy Fürstenfeld, SchH1). Both females Gwendy and Alexa feature an excellent head in addition to their excellent body type. Furthermore, both females posses the highest level of training.

	Brutus v. Nymphenburg

Helena v. Eschenhof

I would like to mention the V female Helena v. Eschenhof, who is the dam of the Nymphenburg B-litter. This female has a very good temperament, coupled with very good fighting spirit. Since 1978 Helena has had considerable success at the annual DV Siegerprüfungen. The “B” litter such as Baucis, Bellona and also Brutus have slightly more bone strength, which is important in terms of breeding. Their temperament is considered normal, with more hardness desired.